Monday, November 3, 2008

A Few Final Words for Election Day Eve

It's weird, even though I totally have seen this "historic" day coming, Election Day still sorta sneaked up on me this time around. I'm pretty sure how I'm going to vote, but I'm actually not quite sure how it's all going to turn out. Last time I was pretty darn sure President Bush had it in the bag, but this time, I'm just not certain. I definitely have hope for a certain direction, but we will see.

So, rather than post a lengthy rant about my personal politics, I will post a few videos I've run into online lately.

Honestly, these terrify me, and they seem like the people making them are completely serious about them, which scares me even more. Make of them what you will.

There is something so manipulative and wrong about using unwitting kids to further a political agenda, and everything about this song (especially the conductor) screams Communism. Word is Obama, obviously touched by the "spontaneous" display of affection and support from children who don't even understand what he believes in, had this creepy, Naziesque song on his website until he realized, well, it makes him look like a Communist.

As for this one, why do celebrities seem to insistently think the public actually cares about their political views? A paganistic chant of "Obama" and a multi-culti display of celebrities reading canned lines isn't going to impress anyone but people who already support him.

This one just amuses me:

So vote!

(...For anyone but Obama...)


  1. This is going to be Nader's year, I can just feel it!

    I like how the one video is black and white so we know that it's serious business. Listen to Jessica Alba, y'all!

  2. Dear Drew,
    You know I love you, so please don't be offended by the following.
    I understand why you have a problem with the children singing the song, but what about that video is communist? Is that what "be as one" means now? All I see is parents who are maybe a little too excited to get their children involved in the political process, and I'm fairly certain that this wasn't a required activity. I tried to find evidence that it was on Obama's website and "removed because it made him look like a communist," but all I saw were comments on other blogs where this was posted, so it sounds like a rumor to me. I certainly don't think Obama is going to start a marching youth organization that will sing his praises and burn books.
    I assume that you know you won't be convincing anyone to change their vote with this post, but I would really love to know what you like about McCain and why you'd rather see him as the president. I think it would be more enlightening than throwing around McCarthy scare tactics. I am probably just as terrified of Sarah Palin as you are of Obama, and I'd love some comfort in that department.
    May the best man win - and if it's not the man I voted for, I will do my best to be hopeful and supportive of the new president. We have some work to do - in education, in economic policy, in foreign affairs, in energy solutions - and turning over a new administration is the perfect place to start fresh.

  3. Creepy. I have the willies after those videos. I think I need a shower now. It's like he's their god or something. I'm scared.

    Okay, I just don't get how people in our own religion and belief system (ahem) will just bypass the pro-choice views of Obama. Seriously, how can anyone think that's okay. They talk about all the other things, but I'd say abortion is very important especially in our church. And as far as lumping Sarah Palin and Barak Obama together. . .Um, lets see. One is running for the president and the other for the vice president. I think we should be much more frightened about who will actually be the president, so sorry, that argument is a little old.

    I don't usually get into these types of comments very often, but it's election day, and I'm sick of holding back.

  4. NICE, Emily! Say it loud, say it proud! I guess it's now or never.

    And Megan, I don't parTICularly love McCain per se, but as I said, at this point I'm down with anyone but Obama, and for many reasons.

  5. If i were voting i'd vote for Obama...but i'm not... because i'm registered to vote in TEXAS and my vote would mean nothing anyway. I know that probably rubs you the wrong way but that's why i said it... because i like to rustle your feathers. :) I would only vote for obama (after looking at all the issues) because McCain is old and i'll be damned if Sarah Palin is running the nation. ooooh alaska.

  6. It's definitely the cool thing to be voting for Obama. It's fine for the parents of those kids to be excited for their candidate, but leave the kids at home. If I believed in Socialism and made my 8 year old sing about it, would that not be creepy? I'd be just as creeped out by kids singing praises to McCain or Paul.

    And I doubt that people will flock to support the winner of the election if they didn't vote him him in the first place. We'll have to endure 4 years of people hating whoever won. Just look at the support that G.W. Bush has been getting since he won. Ha!

  7. Disgusting. Is this not sounding off any alarms?! These people are having their kids sing about a candidate for president, and it sounds like they are singing for their God. A CANDIDATE!!! He isn't even the president. Since when is this normal??? I read on MSNBC that a school in Kenya just produced "Obama the Musical." This is when I nearly died. Honestly?! These people really do think that Obama is God.

    It scares me how obsessed people are with this man. He is a man. Why is it suddenly "cool" to don t-shirts and sing songs about presidential races? For a person that will be old news in 4 years!? Maybe people use this as a sorry excuse to feel some what involved in a "historic election" and actually believe that these empty promises of "change and hope" are true.

    I could not be able to sleep at night, knowing I contributed to the deaths of millions of babies, as Obama is so in favor of abortions ("for the sake of the mother's health"... give me a break, that happens in about 1 in 500,000 cases).

    Just you watch. If that man is president, we will surely watch any mention of God disappear from this country.

    I believe people have completely lost focus on why we are even here in this life. What happened to up lifting the family, and fighting for truth and righteousness?! And following God!? I bet he will just laugh at us, as we try to explain we were concerned about the economy and environment rather than saving his children.

    Ok, ok. I am calming down. I just can't imagine how people justify abortion. Seriously. I am scared of this man, and where this Godless country is headed.

  8. I don't normally comment on the political posts either, but as a person who voted for McCain, I actually agree with Megan. I didn't see what was communist about that video. I thought it was a silly arrangement of Obama's slogan's and, as Megan said, it's obvious that this was organized by overeager parents wanting to involve their children in the political process.

    I would also enjoy hearing why you are voting McCain. What issues were the deciding factor for you? Why do you think he will make a better President?

    Also, it's not entirely realistic to completely disregard the candidate's running mates. There is a real possibility that Biden or Palin could be running this country - we don't know what the future holds. As Vice Presidential candidates, they are the next in line to lead and I think they should receive the same consideration and be held to the same standards as Obama and McCain.

    Finally, I think it's completely possible to support a President you did not vote for. Perhaps it's not probable - most are inclined to remain loyal to their candidate no matter what because their choice was made having taken into account their beliefs and the path they would personally like to see this nation take. But there are those (and I'd like to beleive most Americans feel this way, whether that is a naive belief or not) who are simply loyal to democracy - who vote the way they feel they should but support whoever wins because they beleive in the process. At least, that's how I feel. I'm happy to live in a country where we have the freedom to choose and where we can freely voice our opinions.

  9. If kids are going to sing about politics. It should be more like this. It more about education than brainwashing.

  10. Thanks Lin. I was beginning to think I'd been brainwashed into voting for the "popular" candidate instead of making an informed decision based on several months of watching every debate and reading the platforms and news reports of all concerned candidates.
    I was going to stop, but I really feel like I have to say something. I know this may seem hard to believe, but not everyone voting democrat leaves their beliefs and morals out of this decision. There are many moral issues at stake, including the dubious morality of war and the less dubious morality of how to help people who are poor (if you want to talk about saving God's children . . .). You have the right to disagree with his policies there, but I certainly didn't vote for him because of his celebrity or because I was taken in by his repetition of the words "hope" and "change." If Obama becoming president was going to be as dramatic as you say, Lili, I think our leaders would have taken a stand there as well. We are still allowed to make that decision for ourselves, and a different decision from yours does not automatically mean a loss of focus or a choice to not follow God.

  11. Lili - everyone obsesses over something, ie Star Wars, Harry Potter, favorite movie stars/singers/bands. Frankly, I don't see this as obsession so much as how things are nowadays in our culture...we obsess over everything, why should political candidates be any different?

    Whatever the outcome, I don't think either candidate will become old news. This will be part of our history. The long and short of it is that this campaign alone has started a change in our country.

    The truth is, we all want to be involved. That's why each of you voted and that's why all of us are commenting on this post and writing posts of our own. People don't share opinions just to share, they share in the hopes that something constructive might come of it. I think your quotations are misplaced. Presidential elections are historic - they all bring change and most elicit hope for the future. Change and hope are not abstract ideas - they are what both candidates have set as a goal for this country (though they admittedly have different ways of achieving that goal).

    None of us know what the future will bring. No one can say who the best candidate is. All we can do is cast our vote, support our President (whoever it may be) and pray that he is truly working to do what is best for the future of this country.

    And yes, as Mormons we do believe in uplifting the family and standing for truth and righteousness, but who are you to imply that because someone agrees with and votes for Obama in this election that they are contributing "to the death of millions of babies" or other such things (because whether on purpose or not, you definitely implied that)? Don't we also beleive in loving one another? Do you honestly think that Heavenly Father would be disappointed in someone who was merely making a decision based on their own conscience? Of course voting for a candidate for other reasons (race, gender, popularity) is a completely different matter that I won't get into here, but there are far more important topics to be discussed with our Heavenly Father than who you voted for in the 2008 election. Do you not think that He has a hand in all things, including this election? or that He has had some amount of influence in the lives of the candidates? Of course there is opposition from the adversary, but this country was built around God. This world was created by Him. I find it hard to believe that He has had zero influence over the candidates or this Presidential matter what the candidates themselves believe in.

    Basically, this is in no way a Godless country. People have various reasons for voting for their candidate. A vote for Obama does not mean a vote to kill millions of babies. Maybe they are a teacher who likes his plans for education. Maybe they are in the military. There's no way to know unless you ask. Hostility and name calling does not open the path toward a constructive or educational conversation.

  12. Well said, Lin. And much more constructively than I said. :)

  13. I enjoy your posts. I for one, am glad we are coming to the end of this. It has been a nasty race. I hope everyone voted, because that is really the only way we make a difference.

    The singing was creepy. I would be more than a little upset if my kids had been involved. I hope this was not in a public school.

    I enjoyed the super hero video. Funny.

  14. I just want to know, exactly what changes are we looking forward to with Obama?

    And yes, a vote for Obama is a vote for millions of abortions. That is one of his main stances he has used to get into the white house. Just google the words "Obama" and "Planned Parenthood" and you will see what I am talking about. Explain to me how you can justify that? My conscience would be heavy enough with that alone.

    "but there are far more important topics to be discussed with our Heavenly Father than who you voted for in the 2008 election."
    Lindsey... are you serious... So why do we pray for things like getting home safely from church, and that the ice we eat later will nourish and strengthen us, but no WAY is God interested in the moral character of the man who is to lead our country.

    Yes, this is quickly becoming a Godless country. It just depends on how quickly it will happen. Which we will see quite soon.

    In this life, I don't know about you, but my religion and family comes first no matter what. If that means the school systems are complete crap, then I will home school. If that means the economy crashes, then I will find a way to provide. Especially being a Latter Day Saint, my religion has everything to do with my politics. I pray about it, and the spirit guides me.

    I think everyone should study up on their Argentine, German, and Russian histories, and see what happened when THEY started to obsess over candidates and leaders.

  15. Take 5 minutes of your life to watch this video:

    Warning, some of the content may be a little hard to stomach.

  16. If you can't handle the images, skip to about 5 minutes into it to see Eduardo's speech about Obama's stance on abortion.


  17. Lin, do you really believe that this country is not Godless? Do you really believe that God is the one behind the wheel when it comes to our government? Make no mistake that the Lord allows people to use their agency so that he can pronounce a righteous judgment upon them. If they uphold the righteous, he blesses them (such as the City of Enoch). If they raise up corrupt leaders or embrace unrighteousness, his judgments ensue (Nephites, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Jewish nation).

    Further, have we forgotten the prophecies about the Last Days? I am confident that we are quickly approaching/are in the midst of those apocalyptic prophecies. Some of those prophecies include the Constitution of the United States being in jeopardy. And let's talk about Paul's prophecies, too! Look at California and Massachusetts! This country is totally on its way to entirely wiping God off of the map. If you have time, check out this talk:

  18. Apparently I need to work on my self control, because all day I've been trying to avoid getting involved in this conversation but I finally can't not say something.

    Lili, did you think Harry Potter was God? Did you think Edward was God? People being obsessed with Obama does not mean they think he is God, and making a statement like that makes you sound very irrational.

    Also, this guy up here is exactly right--these ARE the last days and the Second Coming is on its way, so I don't think it's very accurate to assign complete responsibility for our country's downfall to Obama. He is not personally responsible for abortions and neither is anyone who votes for him--you can try and blame whoever you want, but abortion is the responsibility of the individuals involved, not anyone else. The end.

    You imply that anyone who votes for Obama has lost focus on why we're here and no longer believes in fighting for truth and righteousness and following God. I feel very sad for you if this is honestly what you believe. You must feel very alone in the world, and what's sad is that you're a lot less alone than you like to think.

    Frankly, Lili, I'm starting to get the impression that you (and a lot of other people on here) are incapable of distinguishing between different people--Obama, people who get abortions, and people who vote for him are all the same to you. Lindsey said that there are more important things to discuss with God than who you voted for, and I agree with her. One person's choice in this election is NOT the same as the moral character of the man who is running the country. Obama will be held responsible for his actions, and as for the rest of us, we can only be held responsible for the choices we made based on research, our beliefs, and the impressions of our consciences.

    "In this life, I don't know about you, but my religion and family comes first no matter what. If that means the school systems are complete crap, then I will home school. If that means the economy crashes, then I will find a way to provide."

    Do you think that God wants us to care only about our families and no one else? Do you think that's what he meant by telling us to support families? I seem to remember that we are ALL children of God, that Zion is a COMMUNITY, that we are supposed to care for our fellow men and look out for the rest of the Lord's sheep. I care about my family and they are more important to me than anything, but that does not mean that they are the ONLY important thing. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think I am.

    Anyway. I guess the moral of this post is, please stop acting like those of us who support Obama no longer have morals. It's ridiculous.

  19. Oh my, what a lot of comments...

    First of all, I think control has the best point of all. Jessica Alba?!? I'm sold!

    Megan, I'm not offended, but I'm actually a little tired of people my own age presuming that because I'm against Obama, I am therefore politically uneducated and that I need to be schooled. I'm not exactly FOR McCain, but I am definitely against Obama. It's rather a choice of the lesser of two evils. And, like Matt said, I would be creeped out if those children were singing as such for McCain as well. There is a lot more to consider than buzztopics like foreign affairs and economic policy, such as topics that REALLY matter in the long run, and in the ultimate perspective. And just because you feel you've educated yourself does NOT mean you have all the information. Why do you think we are so blessed to have the gift of personal revelation?? The media is so skewed it's almost impossible to really understand a person's position based on their public speeches! Look at the character of the person! Prayerfully consider!

    Elise, you are absolutely right. Obama has been turned into a rockstar, a celebrity, which is absurd. This is NOT Survivor, this is NOT American Idol, this is real life. And Miri, they may not think he's God, but they certainly seem to think of him as A god. And I agree with Elise--if you are blinded by the artifice of Obama's oratory skills and pretty policies and conveniently ignore those that contradict completely with our God-centered beliefs, there is something askew. Personally, to show the other side, I'm a little tired of people attacking those AGAINST Obama, implying that they are against agency and are intolerant of other worldviews. Unfortunately, in politics, you are going to get clumped with your candidate. If you vote for someone who is pro-abortion, it stands to reason people are going to assume you stand by him in those policies. Family IS the MOST important thing in this life. There are other important things, but the family is paramount. Other things that interfere with that are inconsequential by comparison.

    This video may indeed be the result of overeager parents' involvement of their children, and that makes it even worse. The indoctrination has never been more apparent.

    And Lin, we do all obsess over things, but fictional characters and literature are COMPLETELY different from politics and real-life issues.

    I completely agree with Elise's assessment, as well as chiv keeb's. This is a clear sign that the Last Days are upon us, and to say that Obama's election was the work of God (although I do agree that God is and has always been a part of the founding and success of this country) is indeed naive. Like chiv keeb said, we are clearly seeing prophetic fulfillment.

    I personally think this "change" crap is going to be revealed to be just that--a bunch of empty promises. I'd just as soon believe that he's going to put Coca-Cola in all the drinking fountains. This entire campaign has been very juvenile.

    Heaven help us all.

  20. 1. First of all, that abortion video is absurd. He actually says that in the United States abortion is legal through the nine months of pregnancy. That's just false.

    Second of all, Obama's view on abortion is thus:
    Barack Obama understands that abortion is a divisive issue, and respects those who disagree with him. However, he has been a consistent champion of reproductive choice and will make preserving women's rights under Roe v. Wade a priority as President. He opposes any constitutional amendment to overturn the Supreme Court's decision in that case.

    Please stop sending me the video, I've watched it now and think it is completely false. I will be deleting it from my blog comments and facebook.

    2. I feel I must state again that I voted for McCain, in part because of his views on abortion.

    3. I don't feel as though my comments (or Megan's and Miri's for that matter) elicit the hostility of your (Drew and Lili) responses. You've now either outright stated or implied that a)a vote for Obama (or any democrat, since his views on abortion are that of the democratic party) is a vote for killing millions of babies, b)we obviously have not made enough effort to make a prayerful, informed decision, c)we don't believe in uplifting the family and d)that we believe that our opinions are superior to yours.

    My words in particular have been twisted. I tried to keep my comments general and constructive. I've written a lengthy post regarding this and feel I will leave it at that. I stand by my comments as they are written.

    I have faith in this country and it's people and faith in the gospel...without faith in those things, life would be unbearable. I believe that anyone who has an opposing point of view has the right to that point of view and I enjoy learning about those different points of view in a constructive and understanding atmosphere. It's important to remember that we are not only meant to uplift families - we are meant, as Miri said, to uplift everyone in our lives. We are all brothers and sisters and everyone deserves our love and understanding - especially the President of our country.

    I have much more to say, but I don't believe that further discussion would make any difference. It is what it is - and that is, again, one of the things I love about this country. We have the right to disagree and believe different things.

  21. there are tons of songs and musicals written about joseph smith....and jesus, for that matter. how come now one is complaining about kids singing about those leaders?

  22. ... Seriously?... You don't see the difference?

    Just in case you are really wondering, Joseph Smith was a Prophet, called of God to bring in the Restoration of the Gospel in the last days. Jesus Christ was the Son of God who came to earth to atone for our sins and enable us to return to live with God someday. So yeah, I think they're a little more deserving of this brand of praise than a freshly-elected political leader. It is GOOD to teach kids to worship Jesus in song. It is NOT good to involve kids in furthering a political agenda.


  23. To go off on a bit of a tangent for a moment:

    Family IS the MOST important thing in this life.

    Sorry, but I must respectfully disagree. While family is right up there as *one of* the most important things, one's individual relationship with God is--has to be--more important. I'm thinking about this a lot just recently, specifically about people who convert to Mormonism from another faith and whose families ostracize them for making this decision. More even than their relationship with family members, their personal relationship with their Creator helps them pull through the sense of betrayal and pain and allows them to go on in the Church without anger or bitterness.

    Family is important, and in ideal situations one's family can be a source of great strength and love, but family is not as important as a close, personal and loving relationship with God.

  24. so now you speak for God? what if He is thrilled that obama won? i'm just saying it's ridiculous to call it communist to write songs about a person you respect and support. plus parents are teaching their kids worse things that politcal songs.

  25. THAN political songs, not that. sorry for the typo.

  26. TPK, that is definitely fair. Relationship with the Godhead is definitely more important. I guess what I meant was THE most important temporal thing, especially within the context of government and society, family has to be the first priority. God always should and always must come first, but modern revelation certainly indicates that our primary temporal responsibility lies in the family.

    That's all. :)

  27. I will just say, getting excited about a book release is in no way comparable to the leader of our country. That is a silly book. A president decides the fate of the American people.

    I absolutely can't believe you think that something as important as a presidential election is not important enough to discuss with God. Why would God think that anything is important then? Why waste his time with anything? Are we a religious people or not? God is every where, in every thing.

    How dare you discredit that video. I guess you missed the part where thousands of babies were being cut up and killed. No matter how the movie was put together, it is still happening.

    Will someone please, PLEASE tell me as well that their religion comes first? PLEASE!?

    Anyway, that is all. I will say it again, and I will stand by it for the rest of my life. God comes first in my life, and his will shall be done. Even if it means if my family has to live in a hole, living off grass, and praying in secret. My Heavenly Father and his plan always comes first. End.

  28. Lili, at what point did anyone say that discussing the presidential election was not important enough to discuss with God? Seriously? Please find it for me and show me.

    I believe what we are saying, and what Lindsey and Megan have quoted us as saying many times, is that we DID prayerfully consider our choices, and that we DO think that God has an interest in who runs our country. It was very clear, it's been said many times, and I'm sure that anyone who read this can find it. I'm having a hard time understanding what your problem is with this particular issue.

  29. Lili, excitement and obsession are two different things. I was making a point. People obsess over silly things, including other people AND fictional characters.

    "I absolutely can't believe you think that something as important as a presidential election is not important enough to discuss with God."

    I do not believe I said such a thing. What I said is that there will be more important things to discuss with Him AFTER this life. I also said that the most any of us can do is research, pray and make the vote our conscience allows, then continue to pray for whoever should win. I believe I also said that praying for such things as safety and nourishment only furthers our personal relationship with God. Why would I deem those things important and not praying for an election or candidate? I don't. They are equally important. What I don't believe is that after this life, when giving an account of my time on earth, God will be disappointed in whichever candidate I voted for in any election. If there was a right and a wrong in this situation, I believe the First Presidency would take a stand and direct us how to vote (as they did with Prop 8). I would follow that direction knowing it was what God truly wanted. But this isn't the case. We were told to vote how we see fit in accordance with our beliefs and feelings of conscience.

    "How dare you discredit that video. I guess you missed the part where thousands of babies were being cut up and killed. No matter how the movie was put together, it is still happening."

    How DARE I? I suppose you missed the part where complete lies were being represented as fact. I don't dispute that babies are being killed - abortion is a terrible truth in this world. But there is more to it than politics. Outrageous statistics and downright lies are not going to convince me that Barack Obama is a bad person.

    "Will someone please, PLEASE tell me as well that their religion comes first? PLEASE!?"

    You (and Drew) have made several implications that my character is less than worthy. Perhaps you don't see it that way - but it is the way it sounds. My religion does come first - it is in everything I do and say. BUT, as I have said, there is more to our faith than uplifting the family and standing for truth and righteousness. There is loving as Jesus loved. There is compassion, forgiveness, understanding, charity. I've said a lot about what I believe and where I choose to place my faith and I've tried to say it in the kindest way possible. I agree that the family is important, I also agree with tpk's comment above. I believe that we must stand for truth and righteousness in all times, in all things and in all places - but not at the sake of other people's feelings and beliefs. As a church, we do not force our opinions or beliefs on anyone else. There is always agency. You can hear what we have to say and make a choice for yourself. The end. Please stop questioning my faith as a member of the church because you don't agree with my politics (which, btw, as I've now repeated several times, happen to coincide with yours! I voted Mccain!).

    And Drew, not everyone believes in the same things as us. If you step back and look at our beliefs, they can seem farfetched upon the first listen. There are those who would deem our songs and plays about Christ and Joseph Smith to be vehicles for brainwashing. Some people believe in Christ, some believe in politician's and some believe in nothing at all. That's the beauty of this country and of this life - we have the chance to decide what we choose to believe in.

    I was fine with this entire discussion until accusations and attacks were thrown. It is clear that any constructive thought I've presented (or anyone agreeing with me) will not even be considered by you. But, like I have said, defensive strategies are not going to convince anyone of your cause - no matter what the cause may be. All I ask is that we agree to disagree and move away from the childish implications and back biting. I'm sorry that things have unfolded the way they have.

  30. FYI, whether there were a "right or wrong" candidate or not, the Church wouldn't make a statement. They remain politically neutral on candidates and parties, but when moral issues, such as Prop 8 are involved, that's when they make a statement.

    And Lili, my religion comes first!!! :)

  31. Um. I'm pretty sure that's exactly what I just said. I'm also sure that's what I said in my own post.

    Obviously this will not be ending graciously.

    Way to be.

  32. Ummm... my last comment wasn't a jab. I was just saying that it's not exactly comparable because the Church has always been non-partisan in support. Still trying to figure out how it would be taken the wrong way... Oh well!

    Constructive thoughts are always considered around here.

    And, graciousness is usually returned for graciousness.

  33. Just one comment about what someone said about my comment. I would not have voted for Obama because he's "popular". Though i think a lot of people do. I HAVE seen each and every debate, watched the commentary about the debates, researched all the policies and i STILL would have voted for Obama... so THERE. and IIII think it's naive NOT to vote for him because "oh, if you vote for him, you vote for abortion".... really? that's what your basing your vote on? wow. I for one would NOT want my government telling me that i could not have control over my own body... that is a very personal matter and while most times an abortion is NOT the answer... sometimes between a woman, her body and God.... i think it CAN be. That's all i'll say because i know people will flip out because i "support abortion" and twist everything i just said into something else. I'm DONE.

  34. oh... guess i'm not done... plus.. i want good health care... not McCain's retarded plan.

  35. Ha ha! Oh, Lindsay, even when we disagree, I find your turn of phrase amusing.

    Personally, I usually vote based on whoever's standards and beliefs most closely mirror mine, since that's very important to me.

  36. Haha whoever Lindsay is, I like her. And I agree with her. That is all.

  37. It's funny, everybody, keeps saying they are done, yet they keep coming back for more. Sounds like the Libs, or Lib supporters are the ones that are lonely around here. I think it was mentioned in one of these millions of comments that it was the opposite. Anyone can stop whenever they want. Who's on the defense here.

    And girls, that abortion video is not full of lies. You have to be pretty crazy and almost heartless to not be affected by that, even if you are upset by all this crazy politics. The pictures and videos do not lie. It was horrific and terribly sad. And all you can say is that it's a fraud. Oh dear.

  38. I would like to clarify what I meant when I said that video was full of lies. I do not believe that the images are false - extremely graphic, but not false. I'm not saying abortion is a lie nor am I saying that I condone it. I am not heartless and was incredibly disturbed by the images presented.

    I am saying that the words of "Eduardo" (who is a Mexican actor, not an American voter, doctor or expert of any kind) are false. Abortion does not happen through nine months of pregnancy, LEGALLY in the United States. That one statement at the beginning of the video should send up a red flag.

    I believe I also posted what Obama's actual stance on abortion is (he simply does not want to overturn Roe v. Wade...doing so would then give individual states control over their abortion laws among other things) and that stance (as provided by the source - his own official website) is a general statement which is basically that of the entire democratic party.

  39. You know, posting that Eduardo video everywhere they possibly can is kinda the same as all those "Obama is Muslim" and "here are quotes from Obama's book that we just made up, aren't they incriminating?" emails that got passed around by the Republicans before the election... But wouldn't these tactics be more effective if the "facts" presented weren't so easily proven wrong? That video IS full of lies, and no amount of heart-wrenching horrible pictures will make them true.

  40. Can either of you provide any evidence proving the video is "full of lies"? I mean, since it's so *easily* proven wrong and all...

  41. i think we need to move on from the abortion stuff....frankly, obama isn't going to be worried about that issue for much of his time as president. the country has much more immediate concerns (economy, war, etc) that will be filling his time.

  42. The videos Drew posted are rather creepy. "Communist" is probably not the most accurate label to give to them. It can more accurately be called propaganda. I wanted to get the opinion of an expert on the issue, so I emailed someone I know who got a degree in propaganda. I sent her the links to the first two videos Drew posted and asked what in these videos (mainly the second), and the rest of the Obama campaign in general, is similar to the things she studied. Her response was interesting.

    She responded first about the repetition that is evident in both of the videos as well as many aspects of the President-Elect's campaign.: "The repetitive use of potent, but somewhat abstract terms, like 'hope' and 'change', attracts those who don't have the intelligence or critical capacity to realize that they are pretty much meaningless and no substitute for real solutions; that ends up being a lot of people. The repetitive chanting of those terms, coupled with his name (which rolls off the tongue so much more easily than McCain) links them in people's minds and distracts from critical examination of his policies. He just 'feels right'."

    Of course, she explained, that not all supporters of P-E Obama have neglected to critically examine his policies. There are plenty of people who have done their research and can thoroughly explain why they support him. However, the tactics used in the videos and other places in the campaign do tend to have the effect she has studied and described above.

    She then drew comparisons to the area in which she was able to study most: "The movement I am most familiar with is the Nazi movement, which was packaged in a very similar way, with Hitler's image as savior to rescue a people who were feeling humiliated in the eyes of the world and economically challenged after their defeat in World War 1. He, too, used a symbol (swastika), got large crowds singing and chanting his 'message' (which tends to appeal to primitive parts of the brain, unifies the group and discourages individual critical thinking) and made it socially cool to be involved with his party."

    These parallels are what is really scary about these videos. America is in a strikingly similar position, and the Obama campaign seems to be using similar tactics and eliciting the same response.

    The video of the children, while it may seem like an overzealous attempt by the parents to get their kids involved, raises questions as to how far they will follow their leader. In China, the Communist Party organized the Red Guard, a children's service group who cleaned up neighborhoods and helped old people, to promote social responsibility. That same organization turned into a witch hunt against dissidents and summer camp became re-education camp, all in the name of being "socially responsible". The Hitler youth was the same way, as were the Youth League in Cambodia and other socialistic and communistic societies. I doubt that an organization like the Obama Youth would ever crop up...I guess I spoke too soon. - Click more info on the side to read about the whole story.

    So at least someone had the power and drive to put together something like this. Luckily, it was stopped, and it sounds like those who were made aware of the situation were not happy with it and shut it down quickly. Regardless, it is creepy to think that someone would think this was a good idea.

    Anyway, those are my thoughts on the videos and why they are scary. Germany never thought it would slip into the state it did. It would be foolish to think the same could never happen to America. I have faith that the American people won't stand to go down that road, but I don't know what exactly the future holds.

    P.S. The last video, I think, is pretty dang funny.

  43. I think the phrase you may be looking for to describe the vibe in the videos posted is "cult of personality." You see much the same thing surrounding Kim Jong-Il in North Korea--it often happens when a leader commands absolute power and "encourages" his people to fawn over him. Obviously Obama does not command such power (thank heavens), but he seems to have affected at least some of his followers to the extent that they extol him and chant his praises as devotees do a cult leader.

  44. My name is Ray, so this is a "not anonymous" annonymous post. Communism involves what is called "the cult of the personality", and you see a lot of public displays using young children to praise the benevolence of the "Dear Leader". Kim Jong-il comes to mind as a recent example, but Lenin, Stalin, Mao and many others used the same tactics. The kids performing isn't Communistic in and of itself, but the use of children for propaganda purposes and to advance the cult of the personality is the hallmark of Communist leaders. So, without putting too fine a point on it, I think both arguments are correct (or incorrect if you prefer) to a certain extent. Cult of the personality is dangerous, because once a person is elevated to demi-god and can do no wrong, it seems like a lot of wrong begins to happen.

  45. apparently people do care about celebrities' opinions. we shall see whta the future holds.